kommersant.ru
Autotranslated from Russian
June 22, 2015
“In an attempt to destabilize Ukraine lies a radical weakening of Russia”
Nikolai Patrushev (–russia-insider.com)
This week in Ulan-Ude will host an international meeting of high representatives in charge of security issues, which is organized by the Security Council of the Russian Federation. On the eve of the event the Security Council Secretary Nikolai Patrushev told the “Kommersant” HELEN CHERNENKO about his vision of the causes of sprawl hotbeds of instability in the world and background to the conflict in Ukraine, and also responded to a question about the attitude of the Russian authorities to the Russian citizens departing volunteers in Donbass.
– What is the purpose of such meetings, both in Ulan-Ude?
– The growth of threats in today’s world requires the combined efforts of different countries to meet the challenges of security. In them alone can not cope. That is why the theme of national, regional and international security are discussed at an annual meeting of senior representatives in charge of security issues. In previous meetings, we discussed the issues of joint counteraction against natural and man-made disasters, combat transnational crime, theme food, energy, information, transport security, decide how to cooperate in the fight against legalization of illegally gained in combating the global threat of drugs and illegal migration. In Ulan-Ude and his colleagues plan to discuss ways of international cooperation to combat the growing threat of global extremism and its new manifestations. In addition, we consider of relevance to many countries subject of ecological safety. In particular, we are interested in the problem of growing water scarcity. Due to the fact that the meeting will take place in the year of the 70th anniversary of the Great Victory, one of the report will be devoted to the lessons and value results of the Second World War. I believe that the results of our professional discussions in the future may prove useful in the search for a new system of building international security.
– A foreigner who arrives in Ulan-Ude?
– This will be the sixth such meeting, held earlier in Sochi, Yekaterinburg, St. Petersburg, Vladivostok, Kazan. A year ago, in Kazan it was presented to 60 states and the UN delegation. In today’s meeting will include representatives of more than 70 countries and the UN delegation. This suggests that interest in our ongoing activities is growing. However, it is changing the geography of the participating countries. If at the first meetings were a lot of representatives of the European states, then in Kazan, they were few: only four or six. In Ulan-Ude, the Europeans will be twice as much.
– What are the EU countries?
– I will not single out anyone. Arrive – and then call. Otherwise, the US will put pressure on them not to come.
– That is, the Americans also did not come?
– I think they will decide at the last moment. But if they decide not to participate, we have this is not upset.
– But does the observed recent increase in the number and hotbeds of instability can fight without the United States?
– Reason proliferation of such zones is precisely lies in the insistence of the West to solve almost all the problems at the expense of others. This policy has already led to the undermining of the sovereignty and territorial integrity of a number of states in the Middle East and North Africa. And this, in turn, made it possible radicals and terrorists to raise his head, to strengthen its position. Today we are seeing the effects of the next round of chaos in the world. There has been a very negative trend association extremist cells operating in different regions, under the auspices of the so-called “Islamic State” (IG), which is in fact a terrorist organization, created on the basis of one of the branches of “Al-Qaeda”. This pseudo swore allegiance to such odious structure as “Boko Haram” in Nigeria, “Al-Shabab” in Somalia, some part of the Taliban movement in Pakistan. So did a number of terrorist groups operating in Central Asia and the North Caucasus, including the “Islamic Party of Turkestan” and “Caucasus Emirate”.
– But the United States called on all countries to consolidate the fight against “Islamic state” as a global evil?
– These appeals actually heard. But in fact created anti-terrorist coalition, in fact, used for military intervention in the affairs of sovereign states. Such a scenario, we in particular have seen in Syria, where an effort to shift the legitimate President Bashar al-Assad, has supported opposition forces. That is why the blow to the IG applied there occasionally. It turns out that if the terrorists are fighting against Assad, they can be regarded as legitimate, and if their actions are detrimental to US interests, such as in Iraq, the terrorists should be destroyed. Based solely on their practical interests, determine who of the terrorists is acceptable to negotiate and to deal and with whom – no. I want to emphasize that the fight against individual states or their coalitions against international terrorism can not be effective at all. Terrorism can not be defeated alone or in separate groups. After all, it does not have clearly defined territorial borders and can unexpectedly for such groups to attack them. In this regard, Russia is ready to cooperate with the special services of all countries all over the world, including the United States. Countering terrorism – it is the whole international community, without exception. It would be naive to believe that any of the existing states can remain aloof from the process, or be affected by this threat. Russia insists on the principle that a key coordinating role in this counteraction to play the UN and its Security Council.
– From your perspective, international terrorism today – is the main threat to Russia and its nearest neighbors?
– One of the main threats. In 2014, as part of the IG was established so-called Emirate of Khorasan, which included part of the territory of Afghanistan, Iran, Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan and Tajikistan. The stated objective of the terrorists – overthrowing legitimate governments, and the imposition of Sharia law. In the future, they plan to create in Central Asia a few missions that will liaise with regional radical Islamist organizations. His efforts in the first place, they are focusing on working with young people and ethnic minorities, including through the Internet. At the same time their regular followers are interested not only in religious overtones, but also money. The cases of recruiting terrorists citizens of Russia and the Central Asian republics. Many of them are involved in the fighting in Syria. But the greatest danger they will be returning to their homeland.
– What exactly is the threat posed by them?
– These people are usually included extremist organizations in one of the so-called sleeping cells. Being locals, they are able to fully integrate into the society, for the kind of observing established norms and laws. But at the right moment terrorist leaders can use these “law-abiding citizens” to prepare or direct terrorist attacks. This threat exists not only for Russia and its neighbors, but also for the majority of countries in Eastern and Western Europe. Incidentally, there is already realized and is now actively adapt the legislative framework, significantly expanding the powers of its security forces. It is about this issue we talk to our contacts with partners. Of course, it is important to find a middle ground and not to use the fight against terrorism to suppress the rights and freedoms of citizens, as is happening today in some countries, where the population is, in fact, has been the object of mass wiretaps, the victim of an open invasion of privacy and space.
– Now that we’re back to the American subject: recently US Secretary of State John Kerry arrived in Sochi, where he allegedly handed over the leadership of the Russian proposals for cooperation in Syria. They are acceptable to Moscow?
– We never interrupted cooperation with the secret services of other countries, including the United States. But we say that Assad – the legally elected president, but the United States believes that it is evil and must be removed from power. In order to achieve this goal, the United States supports the Syrian opposition. We say that the opposition it is extremely versatile: there is moderate opposition, but it does not represent the majority; but there is an aggressive opposition, which includes supporters of the IG. It can not be maintained. Previously supported the US attitude to the IG, considering that the organization does not represent a threat to them. Later, they changed their point of view. However, the IG has evolved into the most powerful to date, a terrorist organization.
– But Americans continue to believe Assad illegitimate.
– Yeah, they think so, but if Assad is now removed from power, the whole territory of Syria will fall under the control of the IG. Who would oppose this structure? Look at what is happening in Iraq. US says it supports the territorial integrity of this country. It is now they support. And remember what happened in the early 2000s! They declared an enemy of Saddam Hussein, pulled the proverbial tube of alleged biological weapons under the pretext of combating this threat killed the head of state. Well, what happens now? Someone like Hussein or not, but he controlled the situation. There was chaos. On what basis did the Americans killed the head of state? And do they currently provide control in Iraq? The same thing happened in Libya, where Muammar Gaddafi has been eliminated. By the way, with him Westerners communicate more than we do. Somewhere in their interests diverged. And now they are making the same in Syria. And why? To IG controlled even more territory?
– How many Russian citizens is already fighting on the side of the IG?
– I think that more than a thousand. There are thousands of people from other states. This is Russia, and Central Asia and Western Europe, and the United States.
– How to stop the influx of volunteers?
– As of today, I do not see such a possibility. This is due to double standards, which I have already spoken. For the same IG when it is fighting with Assad, supported by the United States. At the same time they bombed it. As long as they do not stop the game, all this will continue. We’ve already seen it in Afghanistan. Americans do not like the fact that there have entered the Soviet troops, and they organized a movement “Taliban.” From this, in turn, has increased “Al-Qaeda”, with which the American and some other Western intelligence services had contacts. They held secret meetings, and so on. Then, in Afghanistan the Americans felt that such a policy gives them some positive results, but because they keep it at the present time in Syria.
– In addition to the threat of terrorism, which most concern to Moscow?
– No less dangerous is another way destabilization, to indicate that in Russia often uses the term “color revolution.” The latest example – what is happening in Ukraine. It is clear that a project for the destabilization of the country lies an attempt to create a tool for radical weakening Russia. With this purpose in Ukraine created the preconditions to maintain a constant tension, the further development of extreme forms of nationalism, sabotage Minsk agreements. At the same time solve the problem of hold on a short leash EU countries, who are often without regard to their views and interests of the national anti-Russian sanctions are imposed and approaches.
– And for all are the United States again?
– It is necessary to look objectively at the event. The US is trying to prove that Russia is a party to the conflict in Ukraine. But it is not. In doing so, the United States and are the initiators of the conflict in Ukraine.
– It’s like?
– You could not catch it … It was initiated by all these developments. In a recent interview with Barack Obama admitted it.
– He only said that the US was “intermediaries” in the change of power in Kiev …
– The change of power just became the impetus for the events that occurred there. Kerry is such a helper (Viktoriya.- “b”) Nuland, which announced a $ 5 billion spent by the United States to ensure that these events are organized.
– She said they spent $ 5 billion to support democratic institutions and civil society.
– There was a legitimately elected president, he liked someone or not, it is a matter of assessment, but he was elected legally, and no one denies. But it did not suit the United States. And, although the term of his presidency came to an end and the people of Ukraine was not re-elected to, they decided to throw him by force. It was their political mistake. If they waited, they could hold the people they need a legal way. But they have initiated a coup. Would not it be a coup, there would be developments in the Crimea and eastern Ukraine.
– Is anxiety in Kiev did not start after Viktor Yanukovich under pressure from Moscow rejected the association with the European Union?
– He put the signing of this agreement – and not under pressure from Moscow. He just realized that without delving into the essence of the document and did not know what will its implementation. Ukraine is part of the free trade zone of the CIS, and Yanukovich were simply explained the consequences of such a step. He did not consider them before and decided to take a break to sort out these issues. Accusing Russia of the developments in Ukraine, this is reversed cause and effect: “The wind blows because trees sway.” The initiators of the events in Ukraine – the United States. They are by the coup brought to power people controlled themselves. However, the socio-economic situation in Ukraine tends to deteriorate, so they need to figure out why this is happening. In their logic fits that blame for everything Russian. In fact, they do not care what will happen in Ukraine. They just need to put pressure on Russia, the United States do.
– You have expressed concern the presence of Russian volunteers in the ranks of IG. Why do the Russian authorities do not care about the fact that thousands of Russians are sent to fight in the Donbass?
– IG – a terrorist group, and that everyone recognizes. There are no terrorist groups in the Lugansk and Donetsk regions there. You can also solve everything without a civil war, if you follow the Minsk agreements. But they are not met. In Ukraine today, even in the same family relatives often take diametrically opposed positions and cussing. This civil conflict. We are ready to provide and support the Ukrainian refugees who, by the way, neither the EU nor the US do not accept
– but to go into civil conflict inexpedient.
– But the Russian authorities do not interfere with the fact that Russian citizens are going to fight in the Donbass …
– We have no one to this call and do not encourage this. But realistically, it is impossible to prevent this. After all, 2 million refugees from the Ukraine did not just come to Russia – they have relatives and friends here. They tell them about the atrocities that are taking place there. A further trigger emotions that people go there and participate (in boyah.- “b”).
– What can Russia do in order to help with the implementation of the agreements Minsk?
– Russia has done all that is necessary. You just need to do what is written in the documents. We do not understand why Ukraine is so … no trouble persists after all would not have happened to them if they carried out these agreements. But they do not want to sit at the negotiating table with representatives of the militia of Donetsk and Lugansk. And it needs to be done.
– Ukrainian officials say that if Russia will close the border and cease to support its supporters in the Donbass, then all
he rest by itself.
– We can not close the border. What do we organize the blockade, as it was in Leningrad? For the entire population of Donbass? We practically feed them now, there have living conditions are extremely difficult. Although the Minsk Agreement states that the Ukrainians themselves must contribute to the normalization of socio-economic situation in the Lugansk and Donetsk. But they do not do it!
– In Kiev, said that while there is fire, it is impossible to do.
– So let’s stop to shoot something.
– US authorities are allowed to place in Eastern Europe, a large number of heavy equipment – “to counter the Russian threat.”
– How do you feel about that?
– We all remember the term applied by the Americans in relation to the nearest neighbor Russia. They were called “frontline states”, clearly hinting that the “front line” passes through our state border. Against this backdrop, it announced that plans to deploy NATO command are a contingent of up to 30 thousand. People, as NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg said about the significant expansion of capacity of the alliance since the Cold War. The individual NATO action more like a provocation than a maneuver.
Integrative*Mind 